Season 2, Episode 2: What To Do and Say When Therapists Criticize Your Session Rates
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Welcome to the online income for therapists podcast!
what this episode is all about
You want to increase your rates, you want to market to private pay clients, but you're hesitant because you know the pushback you're going to get from other therapists. So I'm going to talk to you about how to deal with that pushback.
Want to Follow Along…
01:14
Number one, I want you to remember so many of us got into the field, at least in part, because we're working through our own stuff. So when you're fearful about the kind of pushback that you're going to receive from other therapists, please remember that they are likely working through their own stuff and that their pushback is about them, not about you. The reality is most of us have money mindset stuff that we need to work through, whether a therapist or not a therapist, so it shouldn't come as a surprise to us if we're hearing some kind of pushback from therapists, because listen, they're just people too working through their own issues, too. I know sometimes you say like, "oh, I can't believe a therapist would say that." We're all human before we're therapists. So, if they happen to have their money stuff and it's pushing up against your money stuff, try to breathe through it because when it comes down to it, you being able to pay your bills, pay off your student loans, have your mortgage free and cleared on your house, be able to fund your retirement, help your kids with their college, that should not ever be sacrificed for fears about what somebody else is going to say or think about you. And just to build a little compassion about what other people might be feeling. So sometimes if we hold compassion it's easier to not hold self-hate, you know, if we can hold compassion for them it's easier to hold compassion for us. And so I have heard clinician say, "well, I could never afford to pay that rate." And the reason that this is upsetting to them is it pulls some of their worthiness up. So basically, they start to feel like, "well, if you're charging that much and I couldn't pay that much, then what I'm hearing is I wouldn't be, I wouldn't be worth your time, I wouldn't be someone you would be willing to help." And that feels very personal, right? So, we have to do our own work around money so that their money stuff doesn't affect the way that we choose to run our business and support our lives.
03:17
Okay, I love the one about, "we got in this field to help people not to get rich." Listen, first of all, those two things are not mutually exclusive. Right? We can be helping people and we can be getting rich, I know, crazy thought, crazy thought. But we can also be helping people and just living a good life. What I see with therapists all the time, and I hope this will speak to you, is that when they're charging higher rates it's not about getting rich (and totally fine if it is no judgement). But it is about having more time. Time to do the things that they tell clients that they should be doing to live a full life. So being able to go to the gym, being able to, you know, go on a vacation, being able to help their kids, being able to pick up their kids at school and drop them off, right? When I talked to therapists, and I've talked to 1000s of therapists about growing their online therapy practices, what it's coming down to for them is time. And the only way to get the time is to be making more money per hour, so that you get to work fewer hours, working fewer hours means more free time, more free time means getting to live in more balance exactly the way we talk to our clients about living. I can talk to you more about how to set up a business model that is lucrative for you and super service-oriented for your clients, if that would be helpful. I'm happy to talk about exactly how, there are many ways you can set up your business to do this, so I'm happy to talk through the details of that.
04:49
I have also heard from therapists, the judging therapists, "if you charge X amount of money, you're greedy, you're a bad person." And, so this one is is a kind of an easier one to deal with for me, because I know that I set up my rate and I help my coaching clients to set up their rate based on math. It's not based on money hungry ism, or greedy ism, or bad person ism, you know, nobody I've coached is like, "Ooh, I want to take advantage of people," you know, I've not met that therapist yet. And so when that comes up, if I can help you to set your rate based on math, based on a super simple formula, I think it's easy to come back to those folks who are casting judgment and be able to say, like, "I hear you, it sounds like this is pulling up stuff for you and I just want you to know that I use really basic math, a really clear formula to help me figure out what my rate has to be. If you'd like me to teach you that formula so that you know what your rate has to be, I'm happy to do that." So sometimes coming from a really compassionate place helps, but being grounded in your why and for me the why has to be grounded in math for it to like count in my head. That's really helpful stuff.
06:07
The other thing that I hear therapists saying is, "well, if you can charge that rate successfully and I am not being able to charge that rate successfully (usually because they haven't tried), but I have not been able to charge that rate successfully, then something is either wrong with you or something's wrong with me." And most people don't want to believe that something's wrong with them. So, guess who they're pointing at. And it's usually not even if something's wrong with me, I need to learn how to market or I need to learn how to, you know, whatever, it's usually like, I must not be a good person, I must not be a good therapist. And so what's going to come back at you as they're externalizing that is that you're not a good therapist and you're not a good person, not like, "hey, you know how to market, awesome, teach me." I'm willing to be nice if it were just that simple.
06:51
Other times it is, right, we're really focusing on the very few apples that are gonna say mean things, but the mean things hurt and so I wanted to make sure that you have some ways to think about it that frees you up so that you can go ahead and do what you need to do to support the life that you want to live.
07:08
Two, I think it's really important to not expect other people to have healthy reactions to your healthy boundaries when they've not done their own work. And, so if we don't expect them to have healthy reactions to your boundaries, then it doesn't hurt so much when they don't. We are all works in progress, it's okay for them to have their reactions and it is absolutely okay for you not to accept those reactions as your reality.
07:36
Third thing, when they start throwing, "that's not ethical, that's not legal at you," I want you to have a solid defense, my friends. I have read through all of our professional ethics, every one of our professions. There is not one thing in there that says what your rates need to be. The closest at the time of this recording is in the Social Work Code of Ethics where it talks about being thoughtful, of being the word isn't thoughtful, but something like that, being aware of the financial limitations of your clients, right? And, so the way that I think some people read this is that you need to adjust your rate to whatever your client can pay. And here's the reality, nobody really believes that. If you really believed that, and the only people seeking you out were saying, "I can only pay $5, I can only pay $5, I can only pay $5," you my friend would have a boundary at some point, right? So we're creating some arbitrary boundaries here. So let's really listen to what that most stringent of the codes of ethics is saying. What I hear it saying is, it would be really messed up if you coerce somebody into doing therapy with you when you knew damn well that they could not afford your rate for the duration of the treatment that they needed. That would be messed up. If you know from the beginning, these folks can't afford this, get them into a service that matches for their income. And you guys, it's narcissistic of us to think that we are the only type of service out there. So private practice isn't all that's out there. Not only that, but even within private practice, there are people doing all sorts of different things. You remember, I was seeing 20% pro bono clients, right? So, thinking that you must see every person is a kind of hubris for us and we've got to work on it. And so when people bring that to you, remember there is no code of ethics that talks about where your rate needs to be set, but you should not be coercing anyone into your treatment that can't afford to pay for the rate that you set your treatment at. I've also never seen a single thing in law that tells us where our rates need to be. There's nothing that says a therapist should charge this, a social worker should charge this, a psychologist should charge this. It'snot said in there. That's just not the way that laws and regulations are made. So there's a lot of interpretation happening and I believe that interpretation is coming from the lens of not having done moeny work, not having done the internal work. The only way for you to know for sure is to do what I have my students and step by step do, which is we literally print out their code of ethics and their state regulations and go through them. And then you know, beyond a shadow of a doubt what yours says. Here's the other thing, when somebody in a Facebook Group says, "that's not ethical, that's not legal," what they're almost always saying is, "I don't think you shouldn't do that." Ask them to cite the ethics code that they're talking about or the state regulation that they're talking about and 99 times out of 100, that conversation is not going any farther, because they're not talking about a true ethics code or a legal regulation. They just don't like it. That goes back to the other things that we were talking about. The last piece about ethics and state regulations is 9 times out of 10. They haven't asked you what professional body is your code of ethics through and they also haven't asked you what state you're in, so they're just talking, y'all, they're just talking. And if they don't like what you're doing, that's okay, they don't have to like it. And if they're saying no, legit, that's not ethical, then I would want to know, like, "point me to that code of ethics, because I certainly don't want to be acting outside of my code of ethics. Thanks so much for letting me know."
11:26
So as we wrap up I want to leave you with something that you might choose to say in response if people are kind of bringing this to you. I hear all the time, when I share my rates, "well, you must live in a state with high SES (socioeconomic status)." And I do, but I can tell you right now, once I did the math on what I needed to make to be able to live the way that I wanted to live, whether my state had pockets of people who could pay that rate or not, I would have found a way to make it work, including getting licensed in other states that did have higher SES. So please don't let that stop you from pursuing the amount of money that you need to make you guys. We have the freedom to get licensed anywhere, you might even be in a compact state where it's super easy to be able to practice in other states. Or you might get your Florida telehealth registration certificate, whatever the heck it's called, right? So, do not let that be something that stops you.
12:25
The next one, "we got in this field to help people not to make money." And I always like to say something like, "totally agree about the helping people and I'm super lucky and grateful that I've found a way to help people and to be able to live the kind of life that I talk to my clients about living. If you ever want to talk about like how to set up a business model like that, I'd be happy to share more about it." I don't do the snarky smile at the end, but sometimes I'm thinking it.
12:57
Okay, third one now, "that's not ethical." So, I'm just going to open that with a question. "Oh, gosh, I have read through the code of ethics repeatedly and never saw that, could you please point me to the specific code that you're talking about so I can check it out? Thank you so much." Snarky smile, leave that out but.
13:21
And the last one, "that's taking advantage of people." That one hurts, and it's meant to hurt, because we're trying, if we're in this field, we really truly do want to help others. So when somebody comes at me with that's taking advantage, that's a really hard thing for me to hear and to sit with. And, so I think sometimes instead of responding, it's either helpful to walk away, like that would hit me hard, I would need to walk away for a while. Or, open it up with some questions. Like, "I'd really like to understand where you're coming from when you say that because it hasn't felt to me or to my clients, as far as I know, as far as what they're saying to me, that they felt taken advantage of. And I would never want to do that to my clients. So if you're willing, and you have the time, if you could share more about why you think that that's taking advantage, I would be open to hearing it and considering what you have to say." Sometimes just opening something up like that, and I've done it many, many times, leaves the other person to reflect and, I would say at least 60% of the time they've come back with. "you know what that might be my own stuff" and they've shared vulnerably about their own stuff. If they come back with some legit things, I personally want to know about it. I would want to know if I'm taking advantage of people and I would want to think that through because what matters to me more than defending my position is making sure that my position is in integrity. So I want to invite you, if you feel fearful that you are taking advantage of people, let's talk that out. So you can come into the Online Therapist Group on Facebook, look, it's totally free. Tag me, again my name is Amber Lyda, and let's have that conversation because I want to help you to think outside maybe of the box of judgment that we're all fearful of. And also, I would personally like to consider lots of ways of thinking, okay? I hope that was helpful, my friends.
15:19
Bonus tips. So I'm going to share with you 1,2,3, 4 more.I hope that they're helpful to you. The first is, "I couldn't pay that so it's not fair for me to charge it." And one of my very closest friends told this to me when I was trying to help her increase her rates and I was like, "um, how you gonna ever pay for it, if you're not charging it?" She was like, "huh, huh." So she did slowly increase her rates using a formula that I gave her. It's a little Excel spreadsheet where you can increase your rate slowly over time so that's super thoughtful to your clients, but also get you where you need to be. And in that same conversation, just sort of funny aside, she said to me, "I don't pay my own therapist that much." And I was like, "well, as soon as you're making enough money, you better." And so, the the end of that story is not only is she at her full fee with all of our clients, but she's also paying her own therapist more, so pretty cool paying it forward.
16:17
The next one here is, "I think your shitty for charging that." Ouch, ouch. I think starting with "ouch" is a good way to respond to that. And I would literally say like, "Ow, that was really hurtful. What was your, like, am I miss reading you? What was your intention?" Put it back on them to respond. And then once they share their intention, if they share their intention and it's hurtful, then I would just walk away from that conversation, I would disengage.
16:46
The next one, "I would never charge that." And I will say to that, "I'm not sure what I'm meant to hear in that. Could you say a little bit more?" Because I really am not. Are they saying it for everybody else who's listening to try to balance things out? I don't know. So I want to ask some questions.
17:05
And the last one is, "I want to be accessible." And this one I hear. And so what I say to that is, "me too, sounds like we share really similar values and so the way that I set up my business model was I was going to have a higher paying rate over here that could subsidize my pro bono clients over here, and the lifestyle that I wanted to live." That's just one business model to help you to be accessible. So most therapists, so let's think of the bell curve as all of the people (that was a terrible curve), all of the people that were serving, most people are targeting the center of that bell curve or slightly, probably the center of that bell curve. Well, if all the therapists are targeting that, it made sense to me to target the tails, so I'm going to target the tail over here with a higher rate. And I'm gonna target the tail over here with a no rate, with a pro bono rate, lots of different ways that you can do this. The other thing that I talked to a lot of people about is we can we can create accessibility in a lot of ways. You could be somebody who has a kick butt referral list, like you really put in the hours to come up with like all of the types of referrals that could be supportive of somebody who doesn't fit for the scope of your practice. That is a way that you are helping with accessibility and, in fact, super helpful way. You might be the sort of person that does higher end or mid high end therapy and then you also have a very inexpensive membership site where you're delivering free useful content over and over or you have a YouTube channel or Tik Tok or something like that, where you're helping people for free all over the place. So there are many ways to be accessible and we don't have to be accessible to all people in all the ways. We get to choose. That's what private practice allows us to do. And we can either work in private practice in an agency style or we can work in private practice in the style that made us come to this in the first place. I hope that was helpful and that really was the last one. Have a wonderful day.
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